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What are the extent of laws and restrictions of importing beetle species ot and within the US and why?


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So I've been discussing with a fellow beetle enthusiast over the email for a couple of days regarding the strictions, regulations and freedom of certain species that allowed to be imported or shipped between countries and between states. Apparently importing stag beetles (both exotic and domestic since the entire Lucanidae family is allowed) into the US is not illegal although vaguely put it seems that those purchasing stag beetles require a permit (again this is not really defined properly). Originally I didn't believe this until the guy I was talking with sent me a pdf file of a page from the USDA website containing a list of species that are allowed to be imported to California. What I did notice though was that rhinoceros beetles was not on the list at all. In the past I have purchased both adult stag and rhinoceros beeltes from other states without hassle or any problems from Bugsincyberspace.com so for me at least I find it a tad bit confusing as there to draw the line with the laws and regulation in terms of importing pet beetle species both exotic and domestic? The problem for me is that there are so many rumors floating around about the regulations of import and export laws on domestic and exotic insect species that I am having a hard time grasping which is true and which is not. Because I don't want to get into any trouble with the law but I also want to know where my boundaries are in matters like this? Does anyone know for certain because I understand that these laws vary from state to state but there most be an overall standard though?

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There are some changes in the works (or there were at least, not sure if other politics have changed anything recently) with regards to easing permitting on several species (mostly roaches, unfortunately) and also simplifying everything else.

 

Here is a page that might help: http://beetlesource.com/index.php/laws

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thanks for the info, i just wish these beetles were availible (manchicoras, anthias) here,like most spiders,scorpions,centipedes etc,i mean they would be flying off the shelves,i know i would be buying them all up like crazy :D i don't why some of the big dealers don't import them in,i'm sure they would sell very well.

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I don't know about this, but I was thinking that we could all coordinate a thing where we pitch in a certain amount of cash (lets say some amount each) and we contribute some cash towards the license and import fee and each person who paid there part can buy themselves the animal or whatever (how ever many they want) in which once everyone chooses said things and then all of it is purchased and then each person gets whatever they ordered. Just two cents.

 

As a note, this is for the FWS license and import fees for the tarantulas and predatory beetles.

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I'm sorry but it's not as easy as that, Kevin. In order to acquire the permit you will need to pass inspection on your facility that houses the restricted species. Such facility is often time restricted to institutional establishments like formal university laboratories used for research purposes, or other establishments such as a museum that provides educational purposes. I work with USDA regulated insect species in a museum and our facility is frequently inspeced by USDA agents. Even if you did manage to obtain the permit, it would be revoked if you did not pass inspection in the future. The process to acquire such permit is also difficult since you would have to go to an USDA representative and pass the interview before you could get inspected.

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I'm sorry but it's not as easy as that, Kevin. In order to acquire the permit you will need to pass inspection on your facility that houses the restricted species. Such facility is often time restricted to institutional establishments like formal university laboratories used for research purposes, or other establishments such as a museum that provides educational purposes. I work with USDA regulated insect species in a museum and our facility is frequently inspeced by USDA agents. Even if you did manage to obtain the permit, it would be revoked if you did not pass inspection in the future. The process to acquire such permit is also difficult since you would have to go to an USDA representative and pass the interview before you could get inspected.

No I was meaning for the FWS import permit for the tarantulas and whatnot. The USDA stuff, I kind of already kind of knew about this stuff.

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Interesting thank you guys for replying and thank you for your insights they are most helpful. I just got a reply from Steven who is the host of the Beetle Source website in Louisiana. His response is the same as yours Beetle-Experience in regard to inter-state imports and exports of insect species. I have read the regulation exceptions regarding beetle but does a species like the Triceratops beetle which is a rhinoceros beetle but is also considered a carnivorous species able to be imported to California without regulations or permits?

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Interesting thank you guys for replying and thank you for your insights they are most helpful. I just got a reply from Steven who is the host of the Beetle Source website in Louisiana. His response is the same as yours Beetle-Experience in regard to inter-state imports and exports of insect species. I have read the regulation exceptions regarding beetle but does a species like the Triceratops beetle which is a rhinoceros beetle but is also considered a carnivorous species able to be imported to California without regulations or permits?

Oh wait Beetle- Experience is Beetle Source your website!?! I didn't realize that you were a member of the forum my apologies of referring to you in 3rd person.

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With the carnivorous part it raises a lot of potential loopholes, like what if they are carnivorous katydids (rhinoceros katydids and red eye devil katydis)? Wouldn't that fall under USDA jurisdiction? And wouldn't goliath beetles fall under the same rule, but the larvae are carnivorous. Assassin bugs?

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Oh wait Beetle- Experience is Beetle Source your website!?! I didn't realize that you were a member of the forum my apologies of referring to you in 3rd person.

Yes, Beetle Source is my site (no worries about the 3rd person, LOL). I have made quite a few connections to zoos and insectariums around the US, so I am able to stay informed regarding laws and permits.

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With the carnivorous part it raises a lot of potential loopholes, like what if they are carnivorous katydids (rhinoceros katydids and red eye devil katydis)? Wouldn't that fall under USDA jurisdiction? And wouldn't goliath beetles fall under the same rule, but the larvae are carnivorous. Assassin bugs?

Yes, these are some of the types of "loopholes" that are being looked into..

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I've heard about the FWS import/export permit. Kevin's idea isn't bad but I was under the impression that whoever wants to buy these regulated species from the person with the said permit will also have to have some sort of a permit (be it USDA, APHIS, PPQ, or FWS) in order to keep the animals since they are regulated species for a reason?

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So what I am curious about now is since carnivorous beetles are technically exempt from the permit requirements would that mean that rhinoceros beetles in the genus Phileurus which are all carnivorous in nature could be purchased and shipped to another state without permit?

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So what I am curious about now is since carnivorous beetles are technically exempt from the permit requirements would that mean that rhinoceros beetles in the genus Phileurus which are all carnivorous in nature could be purchased and shipped to another state without permit?

That would be one of the loopholes that the gov will probably have to go into depth. In from what I gathered, we aren't even supposed to be shipping praying mantids or even native species interstate. In simple and in a few words, those can be shipped to another state. Bugsincyberspace has done it with dyanstes tityus, and many others have done so.

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There are businesses that do ship insects between states, but this does not automatically mean it is legal; people always bring this up when speaking about permits. It is up to the person receiving the insects - NOT the seller/shipper to make sure they are within the law.

 

The person selling or shipping something does not need to make sure the buyer has proper permits, the seller would just need to make sure that they have their own permits for the insects they are selling.

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There are genera that may fall into this "loophole" category, but they would need to be researched or at least cleared by the USDA first.

 

I was researching exotic dung beetles last year, working on being able to bring in some of the huge Heliocopris. The USDA/APHIS cleared me, which was great, but the USDA Veterinary Services did not. They have a (long) list of countries that have hoof and mouth disease that we (currently) would not be able to import from.

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